The current shelter is a reminder of a shamful period in Attleboro's history? Really, are you kidding me? How about before there was a shelter at all? Again, great that you volunteer and love animals but I still have the same argument. Why are we not sharing in the care for these animals? Why does Attleboro, North Attleboro and Seekonk all have to build multi-million dollar shelters at the same time? It makes no sense to any tax paying citizen with half a brain in their head. You can cry all you want about stray, unwanted dogs being put down, that's what the pound is for. We don't have a "no dog gets left behind" policy, if we did, thousands of mutts would live on Pond Street.

somewhat of an overwrought letter! I agree with Paul. Also regarding the cost...! How can it cost or need to cost that much money. You could build a very nice house of maybe 3500 sq ft for that much. Cut the granite counter tops, wainscoating, chandeliers, hardwood flooring, crown moulding, carpenting in the 'office' etc.
The old building should not be torn down - that's just wasteful - part of the 'boomers' generation and a couple of others! I'm a boomer by the way! "buy it, use it, break it, throw it away"! Don't try to fix it!!!! Just go buy another one!!!

why not have a "tri-town" shelter? of quad town- Seekonk, Rehoboth, Attle and N.Attle??? Makes economic sense. Maybe some long time volunteeers would feel "put out" by having to share with other towns? Aaaw, too bad! Atleast the animals would be well taken care of and that is the goal here, right?

Maybe a person needs to be hired to run a major fund raising campaign? A professional, run in a professional way. Much grander than curent fund raising efforts to buy pet food, and everyday items for the shelter.
Set up a shopping list such as a bride does and ask people to contribute materials to build a new shelter. Again, a million bucks is way out of line, IMHO! Outrageous!

Oh, I have offered , a few times, to help with the smaller, routine fundraising efforts to photograph adoptable pets for free. I would take professional portraits of each and let the shelter organization use them, for free! Some of the photoss they use do not show off the animals to their best. No Response from anyone there.

also, presented offer to take portraits at other fund raising events, at a very reasonable cost to the pet owner, and contribute most of that fee back to the shelter.
Still, no response!!! Well, perhaps there was one time "oh, we have a photographer" ! Yes, but, as on EBay, sellers are encouraged to post very good photographs to help their items sell better!

I agree, a new shelter is needed and combining them is a great idea to cut costs. Some towns are talking about combining Veteran's agents to save money. One thing I'm curious about is the cost difference to adopt from each shelter. I've adopted a cat from Seekonk, rather expensive, but that's ok, she’s the best cat in the whole world! A dog from Attleboro, the cost was ok, and of course he’s the best dog in the whole world! And a cat from Pawtucket another best in the whole world cat! Cost was $15.00! The volunteers at all Shelters are awesome and really care but how do they come up with the fees? Just curious. Shelter animals are the best!

I adopted a cat from the Attleboro shelter a year ago. It cost me $150, the staff was great. I had to provide reference and fill out more forms than it takes to purchase a gun. No complaints as I understand they want to make sure that the animals are going to good homes. Attleboro needs a new shelter, a regional shelter if properly managed would make great sense. My only cause of concern at the Attleboro shelter, when I adopted my cat I also brought in $100 worth of Purina One cat and dog food as a donation which I felt they didn't want, as they tried to give me another bag of the same with my Kitten along with all sorts of great toys, treats and food dishes etc. I didn't need any of these items as I already had them, I think it's great for someone who doesn't have these items with their new pet to help get them started. But I was taken back by the staff's failure to thank me for the donation because it was not what they were specifically looking for. I checked their web site first to make sure I was buying the appropriate food. Turned out the flavor of Purina One I purchased was not to their satisfaction. These are shelter animals hopefully on a temporary stay to a forever home, but we all can't have filet mingon even when we are not homeless. People make donations of products with good intentions only to have those items given away instead of used in the shelter.

I have to agree. I've reached out before to offer my services as a volunteer for the shelter or the dog park (I know they are separate organizations). The response? Crickets. Yet I hear and read so often lamentations of how there is so much work being done by so few people and how they need volunteers. Maybe it is just a case of dis-organization? If so, hiring a part or full time position makes sense for volunteer organization. I honestly do see a benefit in having this new and improved shelter, but the price tag makes me wince. I wonder if there is a more efficient way to spend the dollars. I remember when the city council questioned the price tag a few months ago and they were basically called animal haters. But if we could find a way to be wise with the money building the new shelter think of the money saved that can be used on other shelter resources (supplies, etc.)

The more I hear about the staff/volunteers the more I wonder why is a new shelter being built. Does anyone think that a new shelter will change old ways? Sounds like the volunteers want to save every animal but the staff knows what has to be done. Who would want volunteers in their way all day long at their job?

Paul volunteers are there every day including Holiday's. Cleaning cages, feeding the animals, walking the dogs being available for adotions etc.. The Shelter can't exist without the volunteers.

In the 10 years I have lived in Attleboro I have adopted 2 dogs from the Attleboro Shelter and my dealings with the staff and volunteers was very pleasant. The volunteers care tremendously for all the animals and take very good care of them.

I do think it sad that you drive over the border and in Slater Park they have a beautiful shelter.

I think with frugality and common sense during the planning phase, we could have the same thing in Attleboro. It would be good to see if construction work could be donated like a Habitat for Humanity build to save costs and keep the money for the future medical care and supplies for the animals. Volunteers have been used to do work for other projects in Attleboro such as the playground at Willett school, use willing helpers again.

There are plenty of abandon buildings in most towns that could be converted to shelters. The last thing any local town needs is one more new building when we haven't bothered to look at the existing structures.

Thank you Joyce Leven, a taxpaying voice of reason.

Using frugality and common sense were mentioned here, that's a stretch for some, but what a great idea! People would be more than happy to donate time, materials or whatever was needed. Why not look at all building options. I believe the animal shelter in Pawtucket was built with mostly private funding.

Roxanne, I support your assessment. We need a new animal shelter. Period. It's long over-due. To the naysayers and penny pinchers I say, let's be thrifty but not cheap. Whoever mentioned marble countertops. That's a slur. No one is talking about a palace. What's being proposed is a state of the art facility not something grandious.

As for all you who 'know better' than those involved in the planning, it's easy to do a whack job on the plans. But it's not going to work--this time. There is a whole cohort who are working to get this through. A new generation of people who care and are finding and using their political energy.

The longer we wait, the more it's going to cost. People looking to adopt a cat or dog go from on shelter to another. I got one of my best cats from the town of Cranston's shelter. If the shelter is substandard, they'll go somewhere else.

I don't think anyone here is saying an animal shelter isn't needed. Of course it is! I think there are some great ideas here! Unfortunetly, we do need to look at cost. Thats being realistic. We have lots coming up that we need to pay for and our paychecks just don't go that far anymore, so lets do the best we can with what we've have. As mentioned, the Pawtucket Animal shelter was built with private donations. What's wrong with looking at that?

Paul let us know when you get a bright idea . We'll be waiting.

Efforts to begin a discussion for a regional animal shelter never got a lot of support last year when I floated the idea. No one I spoke to thought it was worth pursuing. Now Attleboro is left with no option unless Seekonk, Mansfield or North Attleboro are willing to put additions on their new shelters, Their taxpayers are no different than our taxpayers. Should we think that boarding our pets out of town would cost the same as in our own new facility?

"Boarding our pets out of town" whose pets? They aren't ours (yours or mine) until we adopt them! What difference doesa town make?
Seekonk is working on getting an addition! who has spoken with them.recently. Why not? Perhaps the mayor needs to select someone to get a group of citizens from say Seekonk, Rehoboth and Attleboro together to talk this out. probably not existing volunteers who may get a bit 'touchy' about sharing!

Seekonk shelter some 10-12 years ago was run by Jan, who was terrific but most cats were in a room with no window. It was a small and dingy cave. Two of my cats came from there. The work of staff and volunteers was made harder due to the tiny, old, crowded building.
If we go this route of a regional shelter that might result in another 5-10 years going by. Come On folks it's time for Attleboro to step up to the plate. You can criticize and make assumptions (volunteers getting "touchy") but that's a diversion and just dithering.

No one has made the suggestion that we highlight spaying and neutering in the community. Put on pet presentations at libraries and in schools. Let owners know about low fee spay/neuter programs.
Yes, this is a regional and national problem. But it's also a local issue that has been neglected for far too long in Attleboro.
It's time to stop kicking this can (too) down the road. At least a proposal is on the table that can work. As for funding a shelter with donations as supposedly happened in Pawtucket, many of us are tapped out in the donations department. Most charities these days are struggling to maintain their organizations and seeking money from a limited pool of local monies doesn't make sense to me. Then you have New Hope fighting with other charities. No, that won't work IMO.
It's a City problem and it's time for the City to build an animal shelter and stop procrastinating.

paul, there's lots of no-brainer thinking her (or ignorance). Rather than try to derail this, why don't you show up at City hall tomorrow night. You might find your mind changed. Is that possible, that you change your thinking? on anything?
Course I'm assuming you come from Attleboro and have a stake in this. I mean, why otherwise are you meddling here?

I added PDFs of the schematic floor and site plans at the request of Roxanne.

Thanks Jonathan - where / how do we see them?

Steve, below the large picture of the photo, you can see a thumbnail of the photo. Below that are two thumbnails of the PDFs.

rule no. 1:
site animal shelters away from homes and businesses. They are noisy. Most commercial buildings are close to one or both of those.
As for your other comments, the horse it out of the barn. You are too late. It's going to be voted on. IMO it's time to move forward not procrastinate and hinder the process with this maundering.

Tomorrow night is just a hearing! As far as I am aware. And do not think that voting is any part of a hearing. The public has their time to respond and influence the council one way or another.
The two bathrooms should have plumbing on same wall,, back to back. The food prep rm & laundry seems way too big. The 'feline area'...what is that huge space for? Who guided this design with an architectural firm?

Is the cost an estimate from M Kim Associates or from a general contractor?

Every shelter project goes way over cost, North Attleboro's shelter is just one example. But folks in North Attleboro have millions of extra tax loot laying around for shelter overrun costs. This one will cost more and so will Seekonk's, that's why we should share the cost or at least consider it, because it's the right thing to do.

@Steve Hopkins - this discussion has been ongoing for at least six years. Apparently you haven't paid attention nor have you taken the steps to find the correct individuals to speak with. You also sound like a very angry man. You have the right to voice your opinion at the public hearing. Good luck. @Gretchen - very thoughtful. Re: food donations - any Vet will tell you a change in diet is not advised. Not only brand of food but also type (lamb vs. chicken).

just took a quick look at the floor plan, may I suggest moving the Mens room plumbing away from the exterior wall. May be a good plan for southern climates but not here.

Another 'prevailing wage' horror story. That looks to be a $350K-$450K building project. And the city must pay double or triple for it? Why? The state 'prevailing wage' laws are as antiquated and useless as that old dog pound, serving a purpose neither relevant nor useful to today's economic realities. Build this facility? Of course. The old one is way outdated. Pay double or triple what it's worth? What foolishness is this? And why do we sheepishly accept it?

This is the first I’ve heard of the cost for this building (thank you Patch). Also, if we can combine shelters (as we are combining Veterans agents) then we do all have a stake in this. We should question it. It's never too late to do the right thing. The inconvenient truth is, there is no more money available to be confiscated from the taxpayers. We need to look at how we can do things more efficiently . The animals need a warm safe place and food no question. I think everyone is asking some very good questions that need answers. The question most asked and no one can seem to answer is how do you justify a million dollar animal shelter? That is allot of money!

Why is this and "All or Nothing" deal? When the topic of construction first came to council the cost was well under 1mil.. (more like 600,00-700,00) Council at that time should have pledged a bond for that amount. If you want "State of the art" fund raise. Or lower the expectation of what state of the art is. You can always add later if necessary. I think it is foolish to strap a city to pay such an enormous amount for the animal shelter at this time. Threat of "It will cost more later" fuel the fire. I appreciate the passion of the shelter people, it is too bad they don't feel as passionate toward people (do we even have a homeless shelter?) or the taxpayer and the burden it puts on them.

While I am all for getting a nicer building put in place for the shelter, why does it have to cost $1million when North Attleboro is spending less than half of that to expand and make theirs nicer? I don't understand the need for knocking down the current building and building a new one from scratch. Whether or not this building holds bad memories for you is irrelevant when you KNOW that money could be just as well spent elsewhere in the community.

because North Attleboro, if what you say is true, is cheaping out.
I wish people here would read the newspapers and see what has going on.
This animal shelter project has been decades in the works. Now all you johnny
come-latelies jump in with your criticisms. Who needs it?
paul, your spreading of misinformation is not helpful. Neither is the panic, here.
Steven, if you think over-runs of costs will happen, then get on an oversight committee. It's time for people to put their money where their (BIG) mouths are. But since most of you are apparently not from Attleboro, I guess all you can do is go negative and vent your frustrations with other things.

Now it's decades in the works. Gretchen the problem is, we're tired of putting our money where your big mouth is. Where is the mis information?

Amy,
as an exercise in critical thinking, maybe go through the above posts, even mine--especially mine--and see who's making emotional appeals, putting misinformation out there, and adding red herring arguments that get us off track, like the charge that the pro-animal shelter people are "shameless" in not caring about the homeless.

Misinformation? The truth hurts! Many of you dog & cat fanatics care more about animals than people. Animals are so cute and they love back. Try going to an old folks home and see how many volunteers show up at diaper changing time. This stray animal condo is going to be a lot nicer than some peoples homes. How about the people that have been waiting for shelter for years? Are human beings considered Red Herrings, and if they are can they live at the animal shelter?

your reactivity and misrepresentations proves my point entirely...

by the way I worked with the elderly for years. How about you Paul?

Gretchen, you are misinformed to think that I (and others) dont pay attention.

Also if you go back to any animal shelter article on the patch you will find people who are NOT in support of building a state of the art shelter, and you and many others have treat us rudly because we dont agree with your opinion. No one really care what we think any way.
Its an election year and the Mayor and Jeremy Denly will point to this get re-elected. See, I pay attention

you are making unfounded assumptions. An election year plays into this but that doesn't mean automatic approval.

I'm not being rude. I asking people to think clearly and use logic. Accusing proponsnts of being insensitive about the homeless is a red herring to distract from the main discussion at hand. It confuses the issues. Saying we don't care about veterans sleeping in the gutter while dogs and cats have a "Taj Mahal" is not having a serious discussion and such comments need to be challenged.

Saying at the outset that the cost will jump to 6 million is scare tactics IMO. Let's deal with reality and not use the scare tactics that infect the national media. Show me proof of other shelters in other towns or cities and then we can deal on the basis of facts. The statements above about the Pawtucket shelter are totally not true.

How do you know the statements arn't true Gretchen. Did you contact the Pawtucket shelter? I wasn't sure, maybe someone can verify either way.

how many critics will watch this with an open mind?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QD9FwNYcYAI

Are there funds available for the MASPCA or other national entities? Has anyone on the 'design committee' inquired about other sources of $$$?

Gretchen most of these people don't keep up with the issues in the city. You'll never win them over so we should just let them complain because they add nothing to the discussion. If they did keep up they would know that the alternatives they speak of have been investigated. There have been many public meetings where they could have had input into the animal shelter. It seems they couldn't be bothered to show up. I'm curious where they get the idea that veteran's are sleeping in the gutter. Anyone care to enlighten me? Do you participate in the homeless count each year? Are you aware that many homeless people who are offered shelter refuse it. Did you know that many homeless people are giving free lodging at local motels? Educate yourselves.

Ms Betty - please, sit back and relax. !!! This conversation was begun on the issue of the cost of this project, and NOT whether it should be built or not. Re-read the beginning of the comments.
when a proposal is brought before the public and with a price, such as this one, it makes people take notice. And they have every right to stand up and be heard whether you and the others on the design/concept 'gang' like it or not. You havae to sit back and take the heat.
How many designs and cost packages have been brought before the public before? How many times was the architect told to go back and re-design, lower cost or what ever?
I hope you all are as aggressive with the contractor when he starts mentioning 'cost over-runs' to continue building the structure as specified.

Stephen K hit it on the head. There is only one thing driving the price over 1M and that is having to pay prevailing wage. For those who don't know this forces any job large or small to match not only the union wage but benifits. Doesn't take long to make a $600,000 job go over a Million.

when the job goes out to bid, you'll get three prices. Add them together and that's what it will take to build the shelter.

Over 100 people strong last night, we united as one and our voices were heard!
What an honor to stand up and be a voice! Today’s Animal Shelters are much different than they were 30 plus years ago when our current shelter was built. The days of the “Dog Pound” and the “Dog Catcher” are long gone and it’s time Attleboro moves toward the future and provide a new Shelter that will accommodate the needs of our community today and for years to come. A new Animal Shelter is more than just a building and very different than a residential design. It is a home (although temporary) it is a home to Attleboro’s animals in need. The combination of animal behavior, disease control and noise control make building an Animal Shelter much different than a building we may see in an Industrial park, and definitely not comparable to the homes we reside in. Animal problems affect everyone, from the stray and abandoned to the neglected and abused. Attleboro’s animals need the basic amenities to keep them safe, healthy and mentally stimulated while they prepare for their next step in life. The new shelter will allow us to provide the environment that promotes and protects the health and well-being of the animals in our care.
Each council member has the chance to make a difference. I and many others who attended last night urge the Council to vote yes and approve the bond for the new Shelter on January 22nd and make that choice to make a difference!

It was probably very helpful that they put other projects with school projects The school is very good with stacking meetings. Too bad it's not a ballott question: Attleboro Mayor Kevin Dumas wants the city to seek loans of $1.116 million to construct a new animal shelter and $3.55 million to upgrade Attleboro High School's athletic complex. Anyway, I hope the puppies and kitties enjoy thier multi million dolloar digs.

Paul, this is where I must comment on what you just said. The fact you mentioned it will be a dog hotel/condo, tells me that you really haven’t looked at the plans and have not been involved in the process. As a tax payer, you have every right to wonder about the costs and whether or not it will increase your taxes. The plan for the shelter is actually not something that is 'state of the art' or over the top. If you do a quick search on other towns/cities in the area that have recently built or will be building a new shelter, the 1 million dollar cost is actually on the lower end - and the cost per sq ft is right around what the others have cost. You may not agree with it, but the standards of animal care has changed (for the better). In order for the volunteers and ACO officers to give the best care and get the animals adopted, the shelter needs to have a HVAC system that separates the quarantined animals with healthy animals that will prevent the spread of airborne diseases, the individual kennels need to be sanitary and made from flooring and walls that will not harbor diseases and are easily cleaned, sealed off quarantine areas that are for animals needing treatment, the proper storage, room for families to meet and greet animals (now they do it outside regardless of weather), and room for the staff to hold meetings and trainings. Also, the council mentioned that there would be no increase in debt since there is debt coming off of the books this year.

Amy, actually the meeting turnaround was not because of the school 'stacking' the meeting. There were over 100 Attleboro residents who attended the meeting who were there to support the shelter. They even had their name called and stood up in support for the animal shelter. So, it wasn’t a 'stacked' meeting because of the school also had a project on the docket. That is what the town council meetings are for - it is an arena for residents to express their opinions about the projects or issues for that meeting. I only saw one person (Steve) speak up in the meeting regarding the costs of the new shelter. I respect that and wish more people would be involved like that instead of sitting behind a keyboard and posting. If you feel strongly about something, then that is the forum to express your opinions and have your voice be truly heard and where you can learn about what actually went on.

*turnout - not turnaround in my last post

Yes, I am, but I was actually there attending the town council meeting voicing my opinion. I am posting because I saw some posts that were untrue and wanted to clarify them.

No Amy, your post was completely untrue regarding the fact that the school project is what stacked the meeting last night. The truth is, most of the people who were there, were people who supported the shelter and had nothing to do with the school project. That is what I am commenting on as being false. I completely understand the fact that everyone's post is regarding the cost of the shelter and not the need. I have never said that. My other post even stated that as a tax payer you have every right to question the cost of any city project. I just wanted to point out that it is not some animal resort that was posted earlier. I wanted to present some examples of what is needed and what goes into a shelter that could drive up costs.

mark, were you there last night? or any of the nights when the animal shelter project was open for public comment? No, I thought not.

It would have been perfectly appropriate for anyone to speak against the proposal. Someone spoke against the water treatment upgrade. The meeting was run well and proponents of the animal shelter were encouraged to observe proper decorum. Frank Cook runs a tight ship and Councilors listen with respect and so do attendees.

This is "not your father's City" council!!! People voice their views. I have on other occasions voiced dissenting views and had my opinions respected. To suggest that opponents were too cowed to speak their mind is a misrepresentation of reality.

Gretchen, I don't have much time on my hands here; what I was trying to say is that not everyone is comfortable bringing a grievance to such a formal setting.

I'm not very politically involved; I don't watch or attend meetings and am not informed as to when things are discussed.. Other things in life have a higher priority and I often lack spare time. But I still do have an opinion about how tax money is spent. I wish voting was an appropriate way to communicate that opinion!

I do appreciate you egging me on and encouraging me to get down there. Perhaps sometime in the near future...

Mark, you are right and most people agree with you. Some of the animal fanatics on this thread think it's stupid to question a price tag that's well over one million and going up as we comment, shame on them! They all say poor Rover has been waiting for new digs since Bill Clinton was in office. If the price was 100 million bucks and Curt Schilling was asking for it, all you animal loving suckers would anti up.

I think these days, people feel very free to call and express opinions with their City Councilor. So maybe call and discuss issues privately. People even call the mayor. I haven't done a lot of either but I called Rick Conti once with something I disagreed with him on. I kept it civil and he was glad of that. You never know when the City Councilor or other leader that you disagree with this time, might be someone you agree with nex.
I'm not involved in City issues much at all but I have issues that I follow and work towards. Things that are important to me, like the environment and supporting the Library. Hang in there, we're all trying how to learn how to use this medium (emails, PATCH, Facebook) and learn how to have constructive discussions. Alas, too many of us, myself included, take sides and go on the attack.
I think everyone has areas of expertise they might add to discussions. What I don't like is those who are just negative. But that's the way the medium is, in some ways.
Be well. Be encouraged. We can all learn more about how to improve this City we all love.

mark, wanted to add that it takes a lot of us a long time to find our voice in public: letters to the editor, speaking at a hearing. It's a process so I'd encourage everyone to push the envelope a bit.

There is $800,000. of debt service being retired this year. That's a loan of more than $10,000,000. These three projects if bonded for 12 years will total approximately less than $700,000. in debt service at current rates. However, rates may change within the time it takes to go to bond. Still, it's predicted that it will not be as high as the debt being retired. No increase in taxes due to THESE three projects. Taxes will always go up within the prop 2 1/2 % allowed.

that's an important point, Dolly. It came out during the hearing last Thursday and I think was mentioned in the newspaper but it bears repeating here.